Thursday, December 23, 2010

A discussion with an EV denier

This is a thread I contributed to today with a fellow on an EV list.

It's an example of what I do every day. It's weird, but I spend a lot of time commenting on various websites and in response to all manner of people who for some reason find fault with electric vehicles. Whether it's because they don't understand the truth of the technology and are therefore just ignorant, or they have some malice toward what it means politically to switch away from oil to electricity, they are compelled to spend energy fighting this technology.

Anyway, the following consists of three emails with someone who took issue with EVs without responding to direct questions. You may enjoy reading them.

Paul
******


Oliver,

You state, "Although our military may be used in some fashion to help
protect our oil interests and plays a factor in our low priced oil, I
do not readily accept the numbers you provided."

Fine, tell me the number you do accept. You cannot be saying that you
think this number is zero, can you? Is the life of a soldier worth
zero? Or, was the trillion dollar cost of the Iraq war (so far) not
based in fact? Do you have another number to share? Or, are you
suggesting that the Iraq war had nothing to do with oil? Which is it?
What are your numbers?

You state, "I happen to feel that there are many other concerns facing
the world far more serious than reducing our use of oil."

So? Does this mean you do nothing about our use of oil because there
are other concerns that are more serious? Can you not multi-task? Do
you not brush your teeth because there are more important things than
brushing your teeth?

Just because there are more important things than reducing our use of
oil does not excuse any of us from reducing our use of oil. The
problems associated with the use of oil are massive and far reaching.
They include enormous pollution of our biosphere, the weakening of our
economy (the purchase of foreign oil is a full 45% of our foreign
trade deficit!), and the national security issues that come from
funding our enemies by purchasing oil from them. Maybe you can list a
few problems that are worse than these (I have a hard time coming up
with any), but for you to claim that you can't be bothered doing
anything about it sounds pretty insincere.

You state, "Any saving of oil that I personally contribute to is so
minuscule that it is meaningless."

Boy, this is a great statement! I assume you don't vote either? Are
you teaching your children that anything they do to make the world
better is "meaningless" because, "hey, you're only one person"? Way to
go, dad.

You state, "The day you convince high school kids across the nation to
ride bikes, walk, or take the school busses to school instead of
driving their cars I will consider limiting my use of fuel."

This is the noise Republicans and other climate change deniers make
when dismissing our attempts to pass measures that will limit CO2.
They say the same thing about China and India. "We won't make a move
to do the right thing till they do it first". These are not the words
of a good citizen.

Paul

Oliver,

You state, "And, be careful in accusing me of contributing garbage. I
have found when someone is only interested in furthering their own
views they tend to call other people's views garbage. Respect
an other man's opinion and you will advanced your cause further.

I used the term because I'd asked you at least twice to tell us why
you refuse to count the externalities in your calculations. You never
responded until now, and the response, I must say, leaves a lot to be
desired. I considered your remarks to be garbage because you were
stating things that were just not true and you were refusing to answer
specific questions. When you respect others by answering their
questions, others might treat you with respect.

You state, "The bottom line is that if you begin with the carbon
infrastructure that is already in place and the present cost at the
pump to the customer and compare it to the cost of unsubsidized
batteries it is more expensive to operate an electric car over a ten
year period than a comparable gasoline car."

True.

It's also true that if you ignore the external costs of dirty energy
for over a century and millions die in the meantime, and you just keep
on ignoring these unpleasant realities, that you can keep on going as
though there are no problems - until your kids have to go die in a war
over oil, until your wife gets cancer and dies, until your nation's
economy collapses and you are fighting for survival with all the
crazies out there with guns. Yes, these things are indeed true.

Paul
******

(In response to Oliver's contention that Nissan wasn't serious about their EV program)

Whatever. If you knew anything about the auto industry and how hard it
is to design, produce and market a new car, especially one with a
completely different type of drivetrain, you'd be more willing to cut
Nissan some slack. But if you want to be angry at them, fine. It's not
going to hurt them one bit. We're going to be sold out on the LEAF for
at least two years, and probably more. Your comment that "Nissan may
have to pull the plug on the whole deal" is crazy talk. Nissan is
spending multiple billions on the EV bet. They are "all in" as they say.

Paul
******

25 comments:

  1. this is very well said Paul and I quoted it when discussing EVs with someone from the Cascade Policy Institute. You can see the thread at the link below on the December 18th 2010 article (you'll need to scroll down that date). The debate is still going on if you and anyone else would like to help stand-up for EVs. http://www.facebook.com/pages/Oregon-Electric-Vehicle-Association/138510433019

    ReplyDelete
  2. Nice discussion about EV's. Hope to gather more information about EV technology. I want to write some reviews about it.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Regardless of man's age, hermes belt mens watches present both classically refined and vintage inspired. Despite searching opulent, michael kors outlet.net stretch and play with their color hues from black pave crystals adorning round bezel to white ceramic bezel embellish with numeric engraving.

    ReplyDelete
  4. What will you choose when faced with the dynamic duo between black hermes belt and white? Elegant black and white watches come in new innovative ceramic, silicone, acrylic or plastic casing and bracelet. Gold and crystal accents lands the final touches on these watches. The Michael Kors Baguette and Glitz watches michael kors outlet have crystal embellishments surrounding the bezel and dial. The Michael Kors ceramic watches have a smooth glossy surface which is highly scratch resistant. The ceramic watches are very popular for its beauty and durableness. Choose between alluring white and sleek black Michael Kors ladies watches.

    ReplyDelete
  5. What will you choose when faced with the dynamic duo between black hermes belt and white? Elegant black and white watches come in new innovative ceramic, silicone, acrylic or plastic casing and bracelet. Gold and crystal accents lands the final touches on these watches. The Michael Kors Baguette and Glitz watches michael kors outlet have crystal embellishments surrounding the bezel and dial. The Michael Kors ceramic watches have a smooth glossy surface which is highly scratch resistant. The ceramic watches are very popular for its beauty and durableness. Choose between alluring white and sleek black Michael Kors ladies watches.

    ReplyDelete
  6. Interested in shopping for a designer breitling watches from a ray ban sunglasses locations?
    These typical merchants of the corporation stock goods which are surplus,
    and all those products which could suffer small defects because of to shipment or at the time of production.
    ray ban glasses that breitling watches typically obtain goods in bulk,
    they get these products at comparatively lower price ranges and also offer prospects enticing reductions on designer goods like purses and rolex watches for sale.

    ReplyDelete
  7. In the event you want some sort of Michael Kors Wallets tote that is certainly both equally trendy in addition to loaded with efficiency subsequently glimpse not any further than this Michaels Kors Michael Kors Outlet clutches. Having trendy types in addition to beautiful overall appeal, they've already come to be considerably wanted because of the fashion-conscious potential buyers throughout the world. The most significant selling point these Michael Kors Purses carriers is usually likely took by means of women of all ages many a long time. Many people come in a variety of styles and designs. In this particular Michael Kors document, most of us will probably examine with small the custom made along with the brand of merchandise.

    Blessed with Big apple, Jordan is usually a considerably acclaimed Us vogue Michael Kors Outlet Store custom made. He / she started off building apparel for the fresh era connected with 21. New that has a stage on the Vogue Company connected with Technological know-how with Big apple, he / she fastly unveiled this Jordan Kors can easily have on brand. Various famous people are identified when using the Jordan Kors Michael Kors clutches. A lot of the well known bands with utilized his or her Michael Kors Outlet Online
    types usually are Rachel McAdams, Jennifer Lopez, Elissa, Heidi Klum, Catherine Zeta-Jones, in addition to Michelle Obama.

    ReplyDelete
  8. If you look closely will find the words hidden in the shoes of "23", two large patterns in the upper side support, three the soles lateral bottom

    ReplyDelete
  9. In That Respect Chanel Wallet is a wide Chanel Sunglasses range ready for Chanel bags choice including the Chanel Outlet Store black leather satin Chanel Outlet bag.

    ReplyDelete
  10. Congratulations on your article, it was very helpful and successful. 150a47e7c01989d09e09db807d403f8c
    numara onay
    sms onay
    website kurma

    ReplyDelete
  11. Thank you for your explanation, very good content. 456c667061dde327f1740397235f3a4a
    altın dedektörü

    ReplyDelete